That's a very good point.
The amount of condensate also depends on where you live and the relative humidity there. Ilive in a pretty arid region and the condensation here is much less than more humid environments.

 

Clux, "So who should I believe? " Only you can decide. And to be sure, I'm just some guy. My intervals are what I have had success with, I tend to keep my vehicles a lot longer than most people so perhaps I'm more concerned. (How many people do you know have ridden the same motorcycle for 19 years?) My F100 I've had for...13 years now. My old 68 Mustang, 8 years. And current 67 Mustang has been with me 9 years. Wife's Mustang, 8 years.
Ford's recommendation sounds reasonable or perhaps you might like to "split the difference" between what they and Navistar say. Incidentally, the new VW diesels recommend a similar extended interval which the VW guys are debating. But this interval also mandates the use of not-cheap "VW approved" motor oil. Which is another whole kettle of fish.
When I spoke about my experience with shortish change intervals I was really just illustrating that there are benefits to be seen over the long term with the naked eye. Or at least that I have seen them. You don't have to be a real expert to tell an engine in really good shape from one that's a turd.
Another factor is cost to do service. I change at 3K. On the bike this is nothing as it only holds 3 quarts anyway. None of my current vehicles hold more than 7 quarts so oil changes with regular oil isn't too big a pain. If I had to change 12 quarts of synthetic I'd be looking very carefully at longer intervals myself.
Is your engine under warranty? Who backs this warranty? It's likely best to follow THEIR recommendations.
There is one thing we do know for sure. Changing your oil at shorter interval will NOT hurt anything.

 

Except your your wallet!






"There is one thing we do know for sure. Changing your oil at shorter interval will NOT hurt anything. [/QUOTE]"

 

My motorcycle s a 1971 Honda cl 450 that I ride about 1000 miles a year, I 've owned it since 1986. I also have a 1991 Bronco that I have owned since 1994. Neither have ever had any engine work or use much oil (although the Bronco needs some seals and does leak some oil). the Bronco has always had 6000 change interval since I owned it, the motorcycle once a year.
My engine is more than 50,000 miles out of warranty. Actually, International has to back the engine warranty on these engines, but the Ford oil change rules still apply.
Actually, It will hurt your pocketbook, and the environment. Seems silly for me to dump 15 quarts of perfectly good oil on the chance that it might not be any good when I can do an occasional oil analysis and find out how long my oil really lasts (and a lot of additional information about my engine) for less money. Do you throw away everything in your refrigerator every 3 months? Be cheap insurance against food poisioning.

 

Err, WHAT? "Dump 15 quarts of oil" ,"hurt your pocket book and the enviroment". Sounds like you are NOT recycling your used motor oil. You very bad man. I'm pretty sure I'm not harming the enviroment much by recycling my used motor oil.
OK, you might make a case for the pocketbook thing. I can generally afford regular oil changes. I find major engine overhauls to be pretty hard on my bank account though.
You've owned a couple of vehicles a good length of time and and have serviced them in a manner you've had success with. Your personal experience should be worth a whole lot more to you than what anybody else has to say about. That super nice 850K engine that I personally serviced for two years tends to mean more to me than as many charts and figures as anybody cares to come up with. That was hard evidence to me but when I tell anybody else about it it's unfortunately just hearsay.
BTW, been quite a while since I messed with CB/CL's but I remember the fiber timing chain tensioners would wear down and allow the chain to "click" particularly at lower RPM's. This is far from unique to these bikes, Hondas, or even just motorcycles. It's just something to check though. You'll likely want some more opinions and to do some more research and testing before deciding this is most likely the problem. Consult your manual but IIRC you just about have to tear down the top end of the engine to replace these guides. On your particular model maybe it's not so big a deal. If it is, then you'll want to be pretty sure that's you have to do. I'm sort of assuming here that since you've had the bike so long you're already aware of valve adjustments, timing chain adjustments, and do in fact own a manual.

 

Ok, first most oil that gets turned in for "recycling" does not get remade into motor oil, it gets burned for heating purposes, which is what I do with my used oil. I'm betting the oil that you put in your engines is not recycled. Even if it is, last I knew it takes as much or more energy to recycle oil as it does to extract and refine new oil. So, your 3000 mile oil change on your gas engines requires twice as much energy to extract, refine and transport for distribution than my 6000 mile change on my Bronco. That hurts the environment. It also costs twice as much which hurts your pocket book.
I use my diesel pickup for work. I have assumed from the outset that the usable life of this engine and the vehicle it is in considering what I use it for will be in the 350,000 to 400,000 mile range. I am absolutely confident based on my experience with diesel engines that 8,500 mile oil changes will will not result in an oil related failure in that mileage range. So some simple math:
375,000 miles / 3000 miles = 125 0il changes X $60 for oil & filter = $7500
375,000 miles / 8500 miles = 44 oil changes X $60 for oil & filter = $2640
That's a $4860 difference. When I get to that point assuming the pickup still has some life in it and the engine is shot for $4800 I can machine my block and heads, completely rebuild my engine and therefore have a brand new engine AND a little beer money left over, or have an engine with 375,000 miles on it that's had 3000 mile oil changes and I don't get any beer.
Pretty cheap insurance, huh?
Yeah, Ive got the click, This bike doesn't owe me much, though. There's a lot of people out there in their 60's the CL 450's was thier first bike, I keep hoping that they will get to be a collecter's item and I'll be able to sell it for enough money to retire on (or at least buy another bike).

 

O.K. clux,
Lets look at Mercedes Benz diesels...
lets say that an OM-617-912-2998 diesel gets an oil change every 8,500 miles and it lasts 375,000 miles before needing major overhaul (using your $2,640 total). Lets look at an identical engine with 3,000 mile changes, lets say it lasts 600K (conservative for this engines reputation). Lets say both vehicles are driven for 1,125,000 miles thats (I will use your $4,800 overhaul cost) $4,800 X 3 versus 4,800 X 1 (or 2)
so for engine overhauls you saved $14,400
Total oil costs are- engine 1- 1,125,000/ 8,500 is $7,941
Total oil costs for engine 2- 1,125,000/ 3,000 is $22,500
If all adds up, everything will be more expensive for the higher maintenance, but that 3,000 mile interval will yield higher reliability and higher efficancy, so there will be a fuel savings in there as well further closing the gap. Vehicle #2 will also have a higher avialability than vehicale #1
All this does assume that both cars have the same miles per week.
Now, that 8,500 mile change would not be bad if car #1 was driven 8,500 miles in 1.5 months using high grade synthetic oil vs. car 2 being driven 3,000 miles in say 8 months with lower grade natural oil.

 

But.... I've got 367,000 miles on mine & it doesn't need a thing. That is after 10,000 mile oil changes (plain ol' dino oil) and I expect it to go past 500,000 miles without being touched.
At 3000 mile oil changes with 14 Qts + Filter at each oil change, I have saved enough to buy a new engine & am still saving.
Add in the reduced oil demand & Gals less waste that has to be dealt with.
Then I think back to when I was 16 & KNEW EVERYTHING.... It was GREAT !!!!!!!!!!!
Wish I knew that much now.

 

Most used motor oil is sold as bunker fuel for ocean going freighters. They run clean fuel oil while in port and then once they are in international waters they switch fuels and let the smoke roll. I've been told by retired ship's engineers that some fuel is so bad it has to be heated to 450F before injection or it will not burn. He hated ports of call because he never got to leave the ship. He was below decks replacing the piston rings because they burned up during the voyage.
At least that is what I was told by the company that pumps out my waste oil tank.

 

just because a engine is serviced regularly dosent mean that it will outlast another engine by any more or any less. there are so many other variables to take into acount, load, speed, operating rpm, lenght of use and how often it is used.Semis for example get an oil change every 10000+ miles. they last over 500,000 before the owners even start thinking about an over haul. this is my take on the whole thing, as long as you run a high grade good oil (I use Rotilla T) use good filters and dont abuse the engine you will be good with 5000+ mile oil changes. how often you need a oil change is dictated by how often you use your truck and what you use it for.

 

I am really considering buying a diesel pickup, and i found a 92 F-250 with i think the 7.3L in it. It has 340 000km on it now, thats the same as what i have on my 2000 F-250 with the 5.4L triton and it keeps on ticking. For $2000 if i pick that truck up, and i get another 200 000 km out of it, that would be pretty darn good. If you guys are talking 600k 700k MILES thats pretty darn good.


16diesel....10 000+ miles on a diesel before an oild change in a semi? Im not sure about that. I dont know exactly how often we change the oil in our loggin trucks, but its quite often. Why? Because we have seen about 3 too many $10 000 bills for buggered up motors due to our drivers not chaning or checkin oil or water level. Also, the driver that took out a rearend on a brand new Interntional tri-drive because he never checked it. To each his own, but ill spend the $30 every 5000 km or 3 months, and take my truck in to get an oil change. Ill also check fluids and u joints etc ever few hundred kilometers, and ill grease it ever month or so as well. Why? It doesnt cost a helluva lot and with the rediculously stupid prices of a new vehicle, its pays to look after them. JMO