1961 - 1966 F-100 & Larger F-Series Trucks Discuss the Slick Sixties Ford Truck

Engine upgrade

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  #16  
Old 10-02-2018 | 01:11 PM
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From: Boise
Thank you TheMonson

Looks like I have a lot of desicions to make. The more I research the more confused I get. I seem to always over analyze projects. Just figure if I'm going to do it, do it right!
 
  #17  
Old 10-02-2018 | 01:15 PM
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TheMonson
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Sorry, didn't mean to add to the confusion! Personally I would rather find out now rather than later, though. I'm putting a set of GT40P on my 92 Mustang myself, the spark plug angle is the reason for the header consideration. It isn't a huge obstacle to overcome but it is something you need to be aware of. These heads can be sourced from a salvage yard or from the usual sources affordably.
 
  #18  
Old 10-02-2018 | 01:48 PM
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66v8baby
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From: Southern Maryland
I'm a huge Windsor engine fan; way superior to the FE IMO. There are so many options in building them. You can get aluminum heads really cheap now.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Aluminum-Ba...UAAOSwWh1bf~CQ

Add a 3.85 stroke nodular cast crank, and stock 302 pistons and you have approx 9.5:1 comp 393 torque monster for cheap using your existing RV cam. You might already have an aluminum intake. Add to that an aluminum water pump and it's much lighter than the FE could ever be.

If mpg is your goal, get an OD transmission. An AOD will bolt up and so will an early 90's MT5 speed from an F150 or go aftermarket.
 
  #19  
Old 10-02-2018 | 03:27 PM
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'65Ford
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If I had a Windsor, I'd stay with it. I have an FE so I'm staying with it.

Windsors have more tranny options and may be cheaper to build based on parts price...engine prep and assembly work would be the same. Besides that I don't know how they'd be superior. FE's have many options as well and can be stroked to 4.25 easily and to 4.375 with care. Each engine family is capable of the same hp and torque per cubic inch...I believe the FE is capable of more cubic inches. With aluminum heads, intake, and water pump the FE weight difference will be negligible since it's a truck (maybe 100 lbs at the most?).

For the heads in 66v8baby's link I would proceed with caution. Less than $500 for a pair of bare heads seems too cheap to be real. That's less than a single bare head for a name brand.
 
  #20  
Old 10-02-2018 | 08:51 PM
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66v8baby
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Originally Posted by '65Ford
If I had a Windsor, I'd stay with it. I have an FE so I'm staying with it.

Windsors have more tranny options and may be cheaper to build based on parts price...engine prep and assembly work would be the same. Besides that I don't know how they'd be superior. FE's have many options as well and can be stroked to 4.25 easily and to 4.375 with care. Each engine family is capable of the same hp and torque per cubic inch...I believe the FE is capable of more cubic inches. With aluminum heads, intake, and water pump the FE weight difference will be negligible since it's a truck (maybe 100 lbs at the most?).

For the heads in 66v8baby's link I would proceed with caution. Less than $500 for a pair of bare heads seems too cheap to be real. That's less than a single bare head for a name brand.
There's no question you can make a bigger FE than Windsor, but he was looking for a 390 not a 455 stroker so that's what I used for a comparison. With aluminum intake, heads and water pump, agreed, the weight difference is minimal, especially for a truck.

I think the oiling design is superior in the Windsor and the intake isn't prone to leaking like the FE. The distributor doesn't go through the intake (really bad design IMO). The FE has a problem with oil drain back with sustained high RPMs (I've seen the oil light come on in my '76 F150 with a 390 when the oil level is down a hl a quart and I'm on the gas for more than a couple seconds. You don't need a cherry picker to remove the stock intake on a Windsor. I also think the Windsor rocker arm design is better especially in a low rpm truck engine, and any aftermarket heads will have screw in studs. As for the cheap Windsor heads, after you add in springs, retainers, valves, studs and rocker arms they will be over $1000, but that's still crazy cheap for a set of aluminum heads and you get to choose the machine shop to set them up properly, so regardless of where they were cast, I'd be willing to bet they'll outperform any stock iron Windsor head including the GT40s. Having said that, the stock 352 iron heads are much better than any stock iron Windsor heads. So in the end, since he already has a Windsor, it's likely going to be cheaper to build a stroker that is equal to an RV cammed FE of similar size and performance will be roughly the same.
 
  #21  
Old 10-02-2018 | 09:38 PM
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'65Ford
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Not understanding why one would compare 351's vs FE's and only mention ability to stroke 351's.

My concern with bargain eBay heads is the chance they're defective and then the buyer is stuck. I didn't see any brand name and cheap knockoff's do occasionally appear online.

I'm guessing your oil drain back problem was a fluke. I've run 4 FE's at sustained 3000 rpms on the freeway with no oil pressure problems. I frequent two FE forums and have never heard of drain back problems.

Aftermarket FE intakes often have to be fitted as I'm guessing for most engines to get a proper fit. Not sure why having a dizzy in the intake or in front of it matters.

I'd stick with the Windsor too if I was the OP. Just trying to show pros and cons of each engine family.
 
  #22  
Old 03-16-2020 | 02:07 PM
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66v8baby
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From: Southern Maryland
Originally Posted by '65Ford
I'm guessing your oil drain back problem was a fluke. I've run 4 FE's at sustained 3000 rpms on the freeway with no oil pressure problems. I frequent two FE forums and have never heard of drain back problems.
I realize this is pretty old, but I finally figured out why I was having a problem with loss of oil pressure in my '76 F150 390 at sustained RPM. My lack of familiarity with the FE and a few comments on the interwebs led me to believe the basic design of the FE was at fault. The oil pump pick-up screen was getting clogged up with a goo in the oil pan. It kept getting worse until it would start to lose oil pressure right off idle. After thinking about it, I realized that could only mean the problem was in the oil pan, as it would start off with pressure and then lose it after the engine was running. I pulled the pan and cleaned out a big slimy clump that would get sucked up to the screen but couldn't go through it. After cleaning it out it the oil light has not come on since.
 
  #23  
Old 03-16-2020 | 05:54 PM
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I have a 95 lightning and the gt 40 heads ,even with that said head work for them is the best bang for your buck, ie bigger valves
 
  #24  
Old 03-16-2020 | 08:58 PM
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James_Western_Canada
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From: Edmonton, Alberta
They're not cheap, but I've seen 351W based engines as big as 468 CI. To go this big, there are no production parts in the shortblock, they use aftermarket block, crank, rods & pistons......having said that, any of these would be way overkill for a "daily driver" type vehicle, but the cost scares most away anyway
The most common "Big" windsor is 454 CI (4.125 Bore/4.250 stroke), but in my travels I remember seeing one that was 468, (4.125 bore/4.375 stroke) sadly, it's been long enough I do not recall who was building them.

Here are some 454's

https://www.billmitchellproducts.com...ere-more-info/

https://www.coasthigh.com/Ford-351-W...its-s/1306.htm

https://www.cleggengine.com/ford-sma...mpetition.html

https://www.summitracing.com/int/sea...gine-type%3Av8

Ford Performance actually has two offerings @ 460 CI
https://performanceparts.ford.com/engines/#351

https://www.cnc-motorsports.com/perf...all-block-ford


 
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