I know this is old news, But I’m losing faith in Ford. First I need to tell you my background with Ford trucks. Growing up I was surrounded by ford vehicles. My earliest memory of a truck was a yellow 1949 F-6 dump truck with a flat head V8 and a plow that probably weighed as much as a new car does today. The F-6 was parked at the farm up the street. I remember one day my father and the neighbor hauled the F-6 out of the woods with a tractor. I remember them running through the gears and turning over the engine as it was dragged up the street to the garage. They had the truck running in a few hours after having sat for nearly 6 years. I still remember the smell of the old varnished gas. I loved that truck and I always thought that one day I would restore that truck to its former glory but never had the opportunity. When I was in middle school my dad came home one day with a 1924 Model T wood body truck he found in a widower’s garage. It ran like a top and we used to take it to car shows and would go out for ice cream etc. It was so much fun to ride around and watch people react when they see such an old vehicle. Everybody waves at you when you drive it around and they don’t even get mad you’re only going 25 MPH. My father ran a construction business and his daily driver was a red F-350 powerstroke 7.3L diesel mason dump. I watched him go from a 7.3L powerstroke, to another 7.3L powerstroke, to a 6.0 powerstroke, to a new powerstroke. His work truck was always the central part of his business that was required to move material, deliver completed work, tow trailers, and was basically a mobile tool box. Those trucks put food on our table and a roof over our head and my father has been very lucky with all of his trucks. When I was a freshman in high school, my best friend’s father gave me a 1965 F-100 V8 4x4. One vacuum hose later the truck was running after sitting in a brush pile for years. It was rotted, had no seat and the cab actually dropped when you pushed the clutch in, but it still ran and to me it was gold. I had dreams of that truck being my first ride. A diamond in the rough is what I saw when I looked at it. I could see myself driving into the school parking lot with that V8 screaming. At the time I lacked the skills and financial means to fix something like that. My dad humored the idea for about a day telling me I needed to just fix the breaks and the clutch, but then I decided to take the front end apart and never got it back together right. It ended up in the junk yard after a while. I always regretted that I didn’t just fix it to be operable and accept it as the rusty junk pile that it was. When I was in college I drove a 1989 ford ranger with a 2.4L four cylinder for a few years. It had a billion miles and never skipped a beat. When I graduated college I got a job an hour from home so I bought a 2004 ford ranger 4.0 V6 with 20K miles. I drove the truck for 5 years and parted ways with it at 168K miles and I have nothing but good to say about the truck. It pulled my boat, hauled firewood, and carried camping gear anywhere I wanted to go and never left me stranded. A few years out of college I decided to re-live my dream of owning a classic ford truck. For months I searched ebay and craigslist for the right truck. Finally I found a 1969 F-100 with a 4.9L straight six 4x4 with a 4 speed. I bought the truck sight unseen from Wyoming and had it shipped across the country. I still have the truck and it has been a pleasure to drive. With 94K original miles and being 44 years old, it has treated me well. My favorite thing to do is take my girl out for a ride in the old f-100 especially in the fall.

Now let me explain why I am losing faith in Ford. In 2012 I changed jobs, moved to the coast, and I bought a heavy boat. A lot of changes were happening in my life at this time. A family tragedy made me consider the present more important than worrying about the future. Now that I had a heavy boat and a shorter commute, I decided it was time to buy the truck I really wanted … an F-350 diesel. I went to Putnam Ford in CT and there it was… a metallic blue, regular cab, FX4, alloy wheels, 6.0 powerstorke diesel with every bell and whistle you could imagine. It was the first vehicle I ever owned with power anything and this thing even had power heated mirrors! Only 54K miles and it was within the price range I was looking for. I was so excited but like any number crunching engineer, I did a lot of research before I bought the truck. I read all kinds of things on the powerstroke forums; blown head gaskets, EGR coolers failing, stiction problems with injectors, bad oil coolers, turbo failure etc etc. When I sat down with the salesmen, I explained my concerns to him in great detail that I was nervous to buy a 6.0 diesel because of their reputation and he agreed with me. I thought…well, they were made from 2003 – 2007 so maybe Ford, as any reputable company would, had worked all the bugs out considering it was a 2006 and was towards the end of its production years. My dad had a 2006 6.0 powerstroke for many years and he beat it with a plow every winter and never had any major problems. I see the 6.0 powerstroke all over the place. These trucks aren’t rare and Ford sold a lot of them. I see 3 of them parked on my street and at least 1 of them every time I take a ride. I figured if they were so bad then why would so many people buy them? I figured the last method of protection would be a warranty. I told the salesman all my concerns and he recommended a Ford factory Basecare warranty for 2 years 36k miles. I figured I would be covered for at least 2 years and if the truck proved to be a problem that would be a good trial period. Well, after 1 year and a few months, last week what I had been dreading happened. Down about a gallon of coolant, blowing an embarrassing cloud of white smoke down the road, my fears were confirmed, my EGR cooler was blown. The dealer told me the Basecare warranty pretty much doesn’t cover much of anything. I thought it was rather interesting they would say that to me considering they SELL that warranty to people. So he told me it would cost about $2,000 to replace the EGR cooler on my dime. He asked me if I wanted the work done and I laughed at him and said I wasn’t about to reward them for screwing me over. Not to mention that the cause of the failure is likely a clogged oil cooler not even included in that cost. So here I am, I owe more than the truck is worth because I financed the warranty, and now I have a HUGE repair bill, and a truck that is a 7,000 pound can of worms.

Now this is where I feel that Ford has failed. If you bought a new Ford truck in 2003-2007 you might have paid north of $50,000 for a truck and the 6.0 powerstroke was an $8,000 option… now consider that is INSTEAD of a V8 or V10. That means the powerstroke diesel cost $8,000 MORE than a V8 or V10. Bearing in mind diesel has been about 50 cents more per gallon than gasoline since 2004, people weren’t buying diesel trucks for fuel economy. They cost more to operate no matter what way you look at it. 15 quarts of oil every 5k, oil filters that cost 30-90$ and fuel filters costing 40 - 90$ every 10K miles, air filters you don’t even want to know. So why would any dollar and cent wise person buy a diesel? Reliability and capacity to do work is the only reason that makes sense, unless like me you just want to make noise drive a diesel or you just hate money and like to spend it. I wanted a diesel because I grew up with them, they are considered more reliable, have greater longevity, higher resale value, and I had a use for it, and heck I just wanted one. The 7.3L powerstroke has an unbelievable reputation for reliability, so why didn’t Ford continue the tradition?

Emissions regulations of 2002 caused the design of the 6.0 powerstroke to have a lot of changes over previous engines. To meet emission regulations they added some new components not required before. Without going into great detail, the emissions controls on these engines are an engineering nightmare. Basically imagine 1,200 to 1,400 °F exhaust gasses being fed back into the engine. Sounds like a bad idea right? Well it is, and that is the root of the problem with the 6.0 powerstroke. Ford had people with 30K miles on their trucks coming back to the dealer with blown head gaskets, EGR coolers failing, bad injectors, failed turbo, you name it and the root of this was the emissions controls (not to mention head bolts which is a whole other story). I am not against emission control, but this is an example of where the system was not designed properly and Navistar should be hung up by their thumbs for making such a crap design. Like most engineering decisions, the design was probably driven 70% by cost requirements so they could line their pockets instead of making a robust system that works like a diesel engine should. Let’s not count out Dodge, Chevy, and GMC that still make diesel engines that have a good reputation and still meet emissions. It’s not the application; it’s the design that is at fault in this case. Noticing the trend, an entire industry propped up for aftermarket parts and diesel shops specifically for the 6.0 powerstroke that fix a myriad of problems that people have with these engines. I spoke with a diesel shop last week and they said they replace an EGR cooler about every week. To do all the recommended alterations to make a 6.0 powerstroke “bullet proof” it might cost you $10,000. I doubt too many people have an extra 10K to put into their trucks just to make them work the way they should in the first place.

Here is where Ford loses my faith. Ford sued Navistar for 400 something million dollars for the bad engines and did nothing for the vehicle owners. All Ford did was try to cut down their warranty costs and recoup their losses. And how did they do that? They decided to not fix the problem. They replaced only parts that went bad and didn’t delve into the actual root cause of the problem. That’s like replacing 3 bald tires or putting a Band-Aid on a laceration and expecting a good outcome. Fixing problems like that is a sure way to have the same problem happen again. Can you imagine paying $50,000 for a truck, and having the warranty expires and then have your head gaskets blow the day later and the dealer tell you to pound sand??!!?! Someone willing to pay that kind of money for a product is not a customer you would want to lose faith in your business! Ford settled several of class action lawsuits. You know what they pay out? $400 for a repair that costs as much as $6,000. That is a pittance and certainly doesn’t make it right in my eyes. Not to mention the claim is time dependent. My repair isn’t eligible because the failure didn’t happen 3 years ago. My truck only has 78K miles on it! I thought a diesel was good for 300K miles without major issues? As far as I am concerned, every one of these trucks is a ticking time bomb. Now I can look forward to reduced resale value because of the reputation, and very likely having to take a huge loss if I ever get an opportunity to sell this tird. But in my case I feel lucky. At least I didn’t buy new and I don’t run a business and I can afford to dig my way out of this mess slowly. But I feel bad for those in much worse situations What if I bought the truck new, head gaskets blow, and then I couldn’t afford the repair on a truck that in working condition is worth $35,000 or more? I could be financially ruined! Park the truck at the dealer and tell them to take it? Default on the loan and lose all my credit? Be stuck paying for a vehicle that can’t be driven? That did happen to people! Ford just let it happen as they struggled to recoup their losses like I am attempting to do now. Where is the integrity Ford? Reputation is one of the primary reasons why people buy vehicles from a particular manufacturer. If that wasn’t the case, everyone would buy based on price alone. Other companies value their reputation. Toyota recalled frames! No questions asked frames replaced on old rusty trucks! Can you imagine how much that cost? It would probably cost Ford less to design a REAL fix for these troublesome engines. Ford you have failed me. Screw the shareholders and their profit expectations. I wouldn’t want to invest in Ford if they are going to their seriously screw most faithful customers. How does that translate to good business practices?

 

There are many people that did a similar thing, and suffered the consequences. Big diesel trucks were never meant to be used as commuter vehicles, and the newer ones with DPF's on them are the worst yet for short trips.

The v10 might have been a better option.

 

You come on to a Ford truck enthusiast forum, and this is your first post?

There's a term for that - now what was it...

Anyway, maybe a more productive inaugural post would have been to define your problem and ask for opinions and maybe some help? I have seen guys on here travel not-so-short distances to help complete strangers change injectors for the price of a couple beers.

I guess what I am trying to say boils down to this simple question: "Do you want to complain about it, or do you want to fix it?" Because your issue is oh so fixable.

 

Ford's Basecare warranty doesn't cover EGR coolers. It took me 45 seconds on Google to discover that.

 

I had a feeling this would be one of the responses to my post. This isnt my first post on here. I was active in the older ford trucks forum a while back but i lost my password and access to a former email address so i made a new account. My problem is well defined, like i said its all old news. I know my problem is fixable and I think i know what needs to be done. I am choosing to have a professional mom and pop shop fix my truck because they have the experience and will get the job done right. Plus id rather give them my money than the dealer. I wish i was fortunate enough to have a garage to fix this in myself and save some cash in the process, but being that it is winter and I dont have the facilities I am not about to attempt to fix it myself. I wasnt asking for help, nor was I meaning to complain. All my point is trying to make, in far too many words, is that i think Ford screwed a lot of people in my opinion. You may disagree and that is fine. Any problem is fixable, thats an easy statement to make. I just dont see any point in defending Ford on this issue. If i thought my truck would last me another 10 years i'd keep it, but now i am not so confident that it will.

 

Too bad i didnt have google at my fingertips when the dealer told me it did cover that. Clearly you just want me to know you are much smarter than me. Thanks, I appreciate the attitude.

 

Well you can cite an attitude but it seems to me despite your claim to having once been a more frequent contributor here you're still starting out as a newbie. Not mentioning your past user name, droning on about something that can is mostly bashing the very brand to which this entire site is dedicated all contribute to not-so-welcoming replies. Can you really, really blame anyone----other than yourself that is?

While you also say any point in defending is there any point in bashing the brand for what is mostly your own personal opinion or fear based upon what is mostly a poor choice?

This thread has all the earmarks of getting out of hand rather quickly given the OP's snarky remarks to what appears as nothing more than a fact about results found via a Google search. Not sure that means anyone is smarter or less so than another but it is a simple fact and most likely offered to refute part of the uber-wordy opening post.

Trade the truck or fix it or whatever----hope it works out for you in the end anyway!

 

Sorry folks, I'm not trying to be disrespectful. I tried to make a point but failed. I'll admit when i make a mistake and i am not trying to be defensive. I can see this just turing into a bashing session on me real quick. I agree this place is inappropriate for my concerns. I should have posted on pissed off truck owers.com if there is such a thing. I am still a Ford truck enthusiast, for me its more of a disappontment with this truck. Ive always been proud to drive a Ford and I will probably continue to do so in one form or another. I see the irony in posting this on an enthusiasts page. Sorry for the wordy long post and for wasting your time Completely missed the mark. I thought it might be better to write what i was thinking about constantly for the past two weeks instead of just getting pissed off because my favorite truck just ate my wallet and doing something stupid. but honestly, i feel bad for people who have gotten it worse. I'll take the high road and just admit that i'm wrong.

 

I apologize. Didn't mean to be disrespectful. I recognize venting can be a very effective form of therapy.

Unfortunately, you can pull the specifics out of your initial post and replace them with references to just about any company of similar size and complexity. It is the dark side of capitalism, and many companies are drawn to it.

 

it might have been better to also put some spacing in your post and cut it down from a long rambling rant to stating the problem.

i got 2 or 3 sentences into your post and got a headache trying to read it.

 

The only thing seeth1911 did wrong is the length of his post!! What the hell is a forum for if not to tell of your problems. Just today I was at my Ford garage because my warreny is running out soon and I had a couple really small issues. They refused to fix anything for totally BS reasons. Then they charged me labor because they said thats what happens if warrenty items are refused. The capitalism system in our country has grown into a rabid dog driven only by greed. It isn't just Ford but after owning dozens of Fords it hurts to know they have gone this way. seeth1911 you keep bitchin, just do it with shorter posts.

 

The thing that shocks me is that the OP did his due diligence, determined that the 6.0L was POS and bought one anyway.

The 6.0's were the very engines that soured me on ever wanting a diesel. Ford eventually did resolve the issue, it's called a 6.7L that is an in house engine.

 

The 6.0's had issues, I wouldn't call them a POS.
A little bit of water in a 6.0 fuel system wouldn't cause 10,000$ in damage, so there !

 

I guess that an engine that only lasts for four years in the line-up is a solid choice.

 

I think that was mostly from emission problems.
I don't doubt that the 6.0 could have been continued otherwise.
The bottom ends were super strong, and they did run nice.
Most of the issues stemmed from the same problems, it's not like there was a million things wrong with 6.0 engines, but yes the issues did seem to prevail for some people.